Revive Our Hearts Podcast

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How the Truth Can Transform You

Dannah Gresh: For a long time Jacque was shamed by guilt and didn’t want to tell anyone. When she came to know the Lord personally, it struck her that He knows everything.

Jacque Chislea: "Well, I guess You already know, so I don’t have to be fearful. But wait, it says that You love me still, no matter what I did or I feel ashamed about. I just need to tell You about it."

Dannah: This is Revive Our Hearts with Nancy DeMoss Wolgemuth, author of Lies Women Believe, for Wednesday, December 16, 2020.

While growing up, Jacque was well acquainted with hurt and pain. She told the story yesterday here on Revive Our Hearts. Her father was absent, and she felt that loss. Then another man abused her at age nine. She came to resent men, even as she married her husband.

Jacque came to know the Lord, but she was still in bondage to a lot of sinful patterns. She told us that story yesterday, and if you missed it, you can hear it at ReviveOurHearts.com. We’ll hear from Nancy DeMoss Wolgemuth in a few minutes, but first, Carrie Gaul is talking with Jacque about the freedom she found in Jesus Christ. The Lord used Nancy’s book, Lies Women Believe and the Truth That Sets Them Free.

Jacque: So in the book, Lies, she talks about “I can’t help the way I am.” I was such an angry, volatile, ugly human being, and I expected everybody to just deal with it. “Look, I have been hurt. I have been wronged. I have the right to lash out, so you all need to just deal with it.”

That was where I was coming from. I believed that. I believed I was a victim of circumstance, so I had a right to act this way, the right to be angry, the right to be bossy. "I am the way I am, and I can justify it."

I practiced that for years. Because I didn’t have a father, because I had been abused by a man at the age of nine, sexually, because of these things I don’t like men and I will not like men; therefore, I will love women.

So I had an affair with a woman while I was married to my husband. By God’s grace, my husband did not lash out; he did not retaliate. Do you know what he did? He poured the Word of the Lord over me. He prayed over me.

We went to our pastor and told our pastor. My pastor told me this was a sin, and I said, “Yes, I know.”

He said, “You need to stop.”

I said, “Yes, I know.”

Literally, the Lord severed that. This was early on in our relationship. This was months into our marriage. I think God that He used that to launch me into this other new world of understanding womanhood and manhood and how He created that to be sacred and to be a holy covenant to one another.

I think in our culture now, man, that seems to be acceptable. I think He’s using that experience in my life to help me teach other women that I know that are battling and that are tripping up over that lie.

They are tripping up over that lie that says, "I deserve this. I am this way because I am. I have my rights. I can do what I want to do. I’m supposed to be happy.”

Boy, those lies can circulate and become a monster. It’s not the way the Lord intended things to be. I avoided talking about it because it is so shameful. It was so hurtful to my husband. But by God’s grace, he has been an amazing man that I never knew before, and I praise God.

My husband and I have been together now twenty years. We’ve been married for sixteen years. The last ten have been amazing. We have three beautiful children that have all been adopted.

Carrie Gaul: Jacque, would you talk to the woman today who is struggling with same-sex attraction—maybe hiding behind that, being afraid. Would you share even the struggle with that.

Jacque: I know that for some women they think that the only person who will understand that is another women. They take comfort in the fact that a woman understands in a way that a man never could.

I’m here to tell you that you’re wrong. I’m here to tell you that Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life. Once you realize that He loves you more that anyone could love you, that will start releasing the lie  from your thought process.

I pray very faithfully for lesbian women because I think they are caught up in the most detrimental lives. We can’t procreate; we can’t love in a holy, covenant way if we are doing that. I wear this bracelet to remind me to pray for my sisters that are lost, that are broken, that are afflicted.

Carrie: And we want to say the God loves them.

Jacque: Amen! He loves the sinner.

Carrie: That’s all of us.

Nancy DeMoss Wolgemuth: Thank you, Jacque, for being sensitive to the Lord.

One of the lies that the devil makes us believe is, “I can’t be honest, or I can’t be open.” And that’s not to say that every issue you’ve ever struggled with should be “out there.” There’s discretion; there’s appropriate context.

Obviously, this was something you worked through with your husband. Otherwise, it wouldn’t be appropriate for you to be saying it here.

There may be somebody in this room or listening to this conversation who would say, “I could never say that out loud.” Because it does feel so shameful. "I have to stay in the darkness." It’s not just homosexual sin. It’s heterosexual sins; it’s any kind of sin.

I remember a woman came to me who years earlier had an affair with a man. This is decades later that she is telling me this. This is something she had determined that she would go to the grave with. Because of the shame and secrecy, she had never had a level of intimacy with her husband that she should have been able to have. Two committed Christians. He had no idea why. She knew why but didn’t say.

But she came me and said, “I’ve been hearing you about walking in the light, and God has shown me this is something I need to share with my husband.”

She wasn’t asking should she. She said, “I know I need to, will you help me know how to do this.”

We prayed and cried and wept, went to the cross. She went to her husband. It was really, really hard, but God had prepared her husband’s heart. God had been prepared her heart. The lie you keep believing is, “I would be better off living in the shadows with the secret. Even if it means that we are just going to exist in our marriage rather than coming out into the light. If you come out into the light you will be rejected; you will not be able to move forward; nobody will accept you.”

That woman and her husband will both tell you today, as I think you and your husband would, that as hard and painful as is it to walk into the light, it is so freeing when you do it in grace and when you get to Christ.

There’s nothing inherently virtuous about saying, “I messed up.” But when you are coming out of secrecy and hiding in shame . . . That’s what David says in Psalm 32: “When I kept silent about my sin, it ate me up day and night.” It says, “Your hand was heavy upon me” (see vv 3–4).

If God’s hand is heavy upon you, thank Him for it. We’ve all experienced that before. It’s called conviction of the Holy Spirit. If He’s making your life miserable because of something, it may not seem like something that massive to you, whatever it is, walk into the light. That’s where you find mercy.

He said, “When I confessed my sin; when I acknowledged my sin, you forgave me” (see v. 5).

I’m thinking of Proverbs 28:13 which says, “He who covers his sin will not prosper, but whoever confesses it and forsakes it will have mercy” (paraphrased).

Where’s the mercy? It was your husband’s grace. It was his forgiveness. But it was also the mercy of God to rescue you from your way of thinking of yourself as a woman, from a way of thinking about other women, from a way of thinking about men, all of those ways that seemed right to you that were going to lead to spiritual death.

God was merciful because you were willing to walk into the light with your husband and with the Lord. He was merciful to give you a whole new way of thinking and living. "I’m not going to let you think that something that is abnormal is normal. I’m going to let you know what is holy is good and is beautiful and is worth having."

When you are willing, not only back in in that moment . . . I’ve shared for eighteen years about women never told anyone they had an abortion or a secret struggle they had with pornography. There can be all kinds of struggles, not just sexual sins, there are other sins as well.

But when you are willing to step into the light and get God’s grace and His forgiveness, His transforming power in your life to having ordered affections rather than disordered affections, freedom from your idols, here’s something else that can happen, and you just illustrated it.

You can then become an instrument of God’s grace and His mercy in someone else’s life.

If you have this past experience with the Lord in your marriage, in your life, whatever, you’ve dealt with the Lord, but you are not free to let the walls down and share with somebody else who might need to hear that, then you are still not really free.

Jacque: When you don’t bring this into the light, there’s not power. There’s no power there. Also, with my experience with the Lord and how much He loves me and how much He said, “You know what? I’ve got you washed. I’ve got you clean now. You can start a fresh, new day with Me.” Then you’re like, "Wow!"

Nancy: God can use you as an instrument of mercy and grace to someone else. There are how many women, probably some in this room, certainly many listening to this conversation, who are struggling with same-sex attraction. It’s a battle. They think, I could never tell anybody. I could never change. Maybe they are having that affair with that other woman now and nobody knows it. Their husband doesn’t know it. They haven’t acknowledged it. They are in the shadows, but you have walked in the light, and you have given hope to somebody still in the shadows that there is mercy when you come into the light.

There are people the God wants to use my life message to reach as I say, "Here’s how God met me in this battle, in this temptation, in this failure, in this lie I was believing."

There are other people, Jacque, Carrie, others in this room, as you tell your life story, not exalting your sin or yourself, but exalting the Savior and His redeeming power and grace; there are people that God wants to use you to speak to their lives. They may never listen to me, but they are thinking as they listen to you, Wow, she’s been there. If God had mercy for her, God can have mercy for me.

Carrie: I’m thinking of that verse in Psalms that says something like, “Their faces are radiant, never covered again in shame.” I wish our listeners could see your face because that’s the beauty of the story you’ve been telling—a radiant face that is telling the radiance of Christ in you.

Nancy: The would be Psalm 34, verse 5. Another translations, “Those who look to him are radiant, and their faces shall never be ashamed” (ESV).

That’s a New Testament principle. When you take off the mask, take off the veil, take off the covering, and you walk into the light of Christ’s face, His face transforms. It’s His radiance, His light, His glory that shines on to us and then shines through us to somebody else who needs to see His face and His grace.

Carrie: There is another verse, Nancy, in Hebrews 4 that talks about Jesus setting us free. "He set free through fear of death those who have been held captive all of their lives” (paraphrased). I always thought that was through fear of physical death, but I think it is so much broader than that. It’s the fear of walking into the light. It’s the fear of being honest. It’s the fear of facing the pain of what you’ve been through in your past.

Jacque: That’s where the enemy gets the power. Just like that cycle of unworthiness, we’re looking in ourselves and we are not looking up, and that’s another lie. It keeps you so far away from the Lord.

Nancy: Jacque, I just want to ask you one more thing. There is so much coming into the light today, even apart from the Christian movement, about sexual assault. You experienced this as a nine-year-old girl. You didn’t know how to deal with it then. You didn’t have Christ; you didn’t have grace.

When you came to Christ, you realized that was part of your story, part of what you needed to deal with.

I’m thinking of so many women today—they’ve either told or they haven’t. Help us think through a woman who is carrying that in her past. She thinking, How do I begin to walk in freedom about this thing that was done to me over which I had no control.

Jacque: One of the first things I did when I came to know Christ was journaling and the prayer time. I wanted to tell Him everything. But I didn’t think I could tell the Lord this because I was dirty, and it was gross and shameful.

But somebody had done this to me. When I realized the Lord loves me and He loves all of me, and He knows me . . . In Psalm 139:13 it says that He knitted us together in our mother’s womb. He was there. He was the one who created it. Then I thought, I guess You already know then, so I don’t have to be fearful. It says that You love me still . . . no matter what I did or I feel ashamed about. I just need to tell You.

So I would start with prayer and would admit to the Lord anything you are fearful of: 
A) He already knows.
B) The blessing comes from you speaking the words and either repenting from the sin of shame or hiding or whatever it is and saying, “This is Yours. I don’t know how You are going to use this, but I need healing. I need help because this is hard. This is hard to live through.”

I think the first thing I would do is just pray and speak to your Lord as if He is your friend, because He is.

Carrie: I love what you said, Jacque, how you were beginning to get honest about not only what happened, but how you felt. You were sharing all of that with the Lord. He meets us right where we are, not right where we think we should be or wish we were, but in the midst of the pain.

I heard or read David Powlison who I think talked about the psalmic faith. He said that often our faith looks very different in the midst of suffering. We say, "Just don’t think about it. God is good, and He’s sovereign, and His grace is sufficient. Therefore, that was in the past, and I’m not going to think about it."

But the psalmist was not afraid to enter in. And that really is the language of lament. That’s the hope. The resurrection gives us the hope to be able to enter into that pain and let Jesus heal it, let Him take away the sting of death.

Jacque: Don’t you think that when we aren’t willing to share and are willing to hide, then we aren’t living in the abundant grace and what He’s created us to be or do.

Somebody needs to hear this story. Somebody needs to know that you can be brave, and you can take this to the Lord. He can remove that obstacle so that you can move forward into what He has called you to do.

Carrie: The truth sets us free.

Jacque: Right. It holds us down when hold on to that anger or that unforgiveness or whatever it is that we hold on to. It impedes our relationships with Christ. It doesn’t get us closer to Christ. As soon as we can be honest about those things to ourselves and to our Lord and we can move from there . . . It takes a long time to move from there. It’s not something that will happen overnight.

I think trusting that the Lord has better things for you.

Nancy: So just a little bit more about the process of dealing with that. Were there people you needed or felt it was helpful to be part of that? Talking about the abuser when you were a child.

Jacque: I told my mom immediately. Actually, I told my brother first, and my brother told me if I didn’t tell my mom that he was going to kill this guy. I believed as a twelve-year-old that he could, so I told immediately.

This is another interesting piece that I think the Lord had still as part of the healing process. The Lord sifted like wheat, like the title of this book. I’ve held it at arm’s length because I didn’t want to rehash all of the pain.

But I have been rehashing all of the pain with the Lord sitting right there with me. That has been the most healing. According to man, or my aunts, or my mom or whoever doesn’t want to deal with the fact that this actually happened . . . It’s very shameful. I get that they are embarrassed that they were not there and I got taken over.

But the healing part is . . . This happened when I was nine, and I just turned forty-four. I’m writing and I’m in prayer with the Lord all the time, and He’s helping me heal through this. It’s taking a long time. It’s taking me being willing to trust the Lord and to be willing to let Him guide me through this. That’s really been beneficial.

Nancy: As you got married, is this something you brought into the marriage? How did it impact you and your intimacy with your husband?

Jacque: It was horrible. It was very hard because I would tell my husband that there were certain things that he did that made me feel uncomfortable. He would say, “I don’t want to be like that man.” So he would retract.

I think that for years there was no intimacy, which was another piece. I’m in this marriage and my husband saying, “You’re way over here to the left, and I’m way over here to the right, and there’s nothing in-between.

And I thought, I’m stuck.

Nancy: What began to free that up?

Jacque: I think our relationship with Christ—just starting to understand who He was . . . and prayer. It was ugly. I remember we sat and read devotions at night, and we’d be snickering at each other, but we’d be doing these devotions, and we would pray. It was just going through the motions and acting as if and hoping the Lord would do something with it.

Dannah: That’s Jacque Chislea talking with Nancy DeMoss Wolgemuth and Carrie Gaul about the way God takes broken pieces of our lives and can make something beautiful.

Nancy, the Lord used your book Lies Women Believe to get a hold of Jacque’s heart and bring big changes to her life. Nancy, we’re praying that this story will be multiplied over and over among our listeners.

Nancy: You know, I’ve been so encouraged by Jacque’s story. It's been an incredible joy to watch the power of the truth of God's Word set her free. My prayer is that thousands of women would recognize the lies they've been believing and would experience the transforming power of His truth, just as Jacque has.

That's what Revive Our Hearts is all about. I'm so grateful for the prayers and the financial support of so many listeners who have helped to make this ministry possible. Now, this year has been difficult one for . . . probably everybody. But through it all we've tried to remind ourselves and remind you that Christ is King. You can help Revive Our Hearts continue declaring that truth in the days ahead by giving to our year-end need. As we’re nearing the end of 2020, we’re asking the Lord to help us meet a one million dollar matching challenge that we've been given.

Dannah: When you make your donation, your gift will be doubled, thanks to some friends of Revive Our Hearts. This means your gift will have twice the impact for ministry as we head into the next year. We want to make sure you take advantage of this generous opportunity as we trust the Lord for His provision because we only have until December 31 to meet that matching challenge. Visit ReviveOurHearts.com to give online, or call us at 1–800–569–5959.

Nancy: Thank you Dannah, and thank you for your support.

How much do you know about Anna from the Bible? Though her story doesn’t get much attention, we have much to learn from her. Tomorrow, we’re going to begin a series about Anna and her story in Luke chapter 2. Please be back for Revive Our Hearts.

Revive Our Hearts with Nancy DeMoss Wolgemuth wants you to discover freedom in Christ. It’s an outreach of Life Action Ministries.

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About the Speaker

Nancy DeMoss Wolgemuth

Nancy DeMoss Wolgemuth

Nancy DeMoss Wolgemuth has touched the lives of millions of women through Revive Our Hearts and the True Woman movement, calling them to heart revival and biblical womanhood. Her love …

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